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Tribal people
#1
Interesting exchange happening elsewhere I thought I'd share.

Anonymous Wrote:Permanent subsistence zones - PSZs have been put forward as an alternative/compliment to the TAZ. See "insurrectionary subsistence" efforts and this article from anarchist library: https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/...ence-zones

Zhachev Wrote:We need tribal zones. Fuck this yippe bullshit, fuck Hakim Bey, too

Anonymous Wrote:With sedentary comes council tribalism. You are no nihilist.,.

Zhachev Wrote:I don't advocate sedentarism. And nah, don't tell me what to do or believe. I am my am-ness.

Anonymous Wrote:Listen your Am-ness, you call for tribal zones, that's tribalism, and all tribes have hierarchies. This leads to feudalism and municipalities, eventually Bookchin, who you can insert in your An-ness.


22:33 Wrote:I can see you instigating tribal warriors with yellow war stripes covering their naked bodies as they charge the police line. So damn medieval and nostalgic of you Baron Zhachev.

Zhachev Wrote:Y'all are just coming after me to come after me now. But that's fine, I do it too. Watch and read carefully how I totally dismantle your shit logic. You can, apparently, only understand the language of the State. You also clearly have no imagination and don't think yourself.

22:33 is making the classic mid-20th century Western (white) anthropological argument that bands or clans lead to tribes, tribes to chiefdoms, chiefdoms to states. This is meant to imply a reverse trajectory from the autonomic. It's progressivism. I reject the implication that once a society becomes a state, autonomy becomes irreversible. Everyone on this website should, as well. It is called ANARCHISTnews after all.

Tribal societies were autonomic societies. Many, if not most, especially before the emergence of civilization, were characterized by their egalitarianism — a combination of closeness and gentleness between those in-group, and a strong rejection of any authoritarianism. They lived peacefully in many cases, they lived happily, and there was a culture of companionship, shared activity, and a premium on autonomy. No one, not even children, were coercive, or felt the need to exert any form of other-control. This was a vigilant, active effort by tribal members. The primitive chief had no power, their word carried no force of law.

Societies maintained an appropriate degree of warlike attributes depending on their proximity to state organization. Those forced into enduring war were the ones more likely to form or succumb states. This zone at the far reaches of state and empire, before the tribal zone, has sometimes been called the barbaric or semi-barbaric zone, and these people are actually the greatest threat to civilization historically, but I digress. "The contra-historical society is any society that avoids or retreats from hierarchy, retreats from history, and the state." This should be viewed as "dynamic avoidance", an "aristocratic refusal" to get sucked into the games of the state at any level. These societies were anti-authoritarian, pro-actively, and avoided the stae cleverly. Some still do today (the uncontacted). They're not just stateless, they vigorously reject the state and are fully aware of its encroachments. They are consciously opposed to their subsumption into civilization.

A tribe is simply a bounded network, communities united by social and political ties, often sharing language and aspects of wider culture. Everyone is "economically" independent, there's no centralized hierarchy.

Our social existence is nothing but a creation in the minds of others. As soon as the state imagines a tribe relating to a states power, its driven to act towards the population like it was indeed a tribe. This can force the population to react in specific manners, and it's all a self-fulfilling process at that point, with the state filling in any blanks as to fit the "tribe" neatly in a box.

Tribal organization itself is a response to the state. Without any states, they're just people, living in communities. So please, cut your honkey-ass reified bullshit out. I need to get some sleep anyway.

Anonymous Wrote:Oh wow, classic noble savage fallacy disguised with stories from pulp-fiction monthlies of fiction-fantasy societies which existed in the mists of time before the arrival of the big bad white supremacist nasty tribes with scary big swords and big nasty chiefs hurting people, wow, what are you smoking warrior boy?

Anonymous Wrote:"A tribe is simply a bounded network, communities united by social and political ties, often sharing language and aspects of wider culture. Everyone is "economically" independent, there's no centralized hierarchy."
Like yeah, in your Disney conception of tribes, of course. But through history most tribes that anthropologists have studied were also bonded by hierarchies. The tribal culture is in itself the product of hierarchical arrangements and rituals.
All thanks to Zhachev, our regular trolls LeWay and SE no longer feel lonely here... :-/

Le Way Wrote:If Zhachev was meaning by 'tribalism' the association or union of individualists who adhere to no political or religious laws or ethics, then welcome aboard Zhachev to the ragged crew of those challenging the dogma and repitition of flawed social processes.

Zhachev Wrote:All anthropology is science fiction. But as far as fairy tales go, mine is more accurate.

"The tribal culture is in itself the product of hierarchical arrangements and rituals." That's what I'm arguing, too, genius. I just contend civilization and the state are the catalyst. And I have no idea how I'm trolling here. All I do lately is sit here and read and reflect and take notes. This is the "no life" you folks are persistently accusing me of having.

Anonymous Wrote:"All anthropology is science fiction. But as far as fairy tales go, mine is more accurate. "
Aaaah yes! It's the same old narcissist cult guru kicking in. Science is wrong but I, right. Because it's ME not dem!
You're another authoritarian dog, zhachev, in need of social enclosures that tribes are, so your power may, one day, expand upon others for more rob & rape. But that's not gonna happen because nobody likes you IRL.

Zhachev Wrote:Blatantly racist now. Unlike you lost purely European fucks, I still know the name of my tribal clan and where they came from in Palestine, and where they moved into Palestine from in the 16th century. You're interpretation of tribal people as "bad hombres", mobbers, rapists, etc., is blatantly racist and incorrect.

Le Way Wrote:So its true, your am-ness is not individualist consciousness, but the conspiratorial stain of megalomaniacal pride which would have all of us making you the chief.

Zhachev Wrote:Am-ness = daoist ziran.自然. As-it-is-ness. I appreciate all the shit I'm getting in many ways, as this is the type of anti-authoritarian practice tribal people did for millenia to avoid the emergence of despotism. I'm not a despot, though. I just want to fuck shit up and cause major chaos. Don't y'all?
Ddj 30:

A general is well advised
To achieve nothing more than his orders:
Not to take advantage of his victory.
Nor to glory, boast or pride himself;
To do what is dictated by necessity,
Not by choice.
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