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  The Reason I Don’t Like Permaculture
Posted by: Zhachev - Sun, 22 Jul 2018 04:00:26 +0000, 04:00 AM - Forum: Skills & Decivilising - Replies (1)

The Reason I Don’t Like Permaculture

Quote:I don’t like permaculture. I can practically hear the gasps of shock. I can almost see the looks of both perplex and anger. How could I not like permaculture? Is that even allowed? Isn’t liking permaculture mandated by some great god of environmentalism?

I never quite liked permaculture. I wanted to like it. I did my best to like permaculture. I read the books. I listened to the groovy talk. I just couldn’t get excited about it. Something about permaculture just rubbed me the wrong way. I decided to puzzle out what it is that I don’t like about permaculture, and that is what this post is about.

Permaculture, for those who don’t know, is a field of study, a set of practices, a way of life, and very nearly a religion that promotes, among other things, perennial polyculture. Many descriptions of permaculture refer to it as sustainable agriculture, which is, to my way of seeing things, a contradiction in terms. In fact, the term permaculture itself means permanent agriculture, which, again, seems like an impossibility to me. There are many other aspects to permaculture beyond just the growing of food. However, growing food is at the foundation of permaculture, and it seems fair to talk about permaculture in those terms.

I ought to first state that I have no problem with perennial polyculture. What I do have a problem with is the attitude with which permaculture goes about growing perennial polyculture. What I have a problem with is the types of relationships that permaculture perpetuates. As far as I’m concerned permaculture does not challenge the fundamentally flawed and dangerous energetics of civilization. Even if permaculture is more harmonious than standard agricultural practices, it seems to me that it leads to the same eventual demise, at least in a spiritual sense.

The relationships of civilization, from what I can see, are relationships of domination. Within the framework of civilization our human relationships are relationships of domination. Even the healthiest of human relationships still has occasional grapples for power. Even our relationships with ourselves are ones in which we seek to control our minds and bodies through prayer, clothing, exercise, meditation, and millions of other practices. Our relationships with other animal species are ones in which we dominate. Just look at zoos, vivisection labs, factory farms, fur farms, dog breeders, work horses, race horses, and every other exhibit of our relationships with other species of animal to see evidence of that. Our relationships with plants are ones in which we dominate. We breed, genetically-modify, plant in rows, clearcut, plant in containers, and decide which are good and which are unwanted. We also seek to dominate rivers and mountains as is evidenced by dams and mountaintop removal mining. Civilization seems to know no limits on its desire to control. The U.S. space program recently announced that they would bomb the surface of the moon for scientific study.

We can see the results of this type of relationships. The results are devastating. The most egregious and horrific results are those that we can see all around us, the fact that our home and our loved ones are being killed. Many rivers no longer reach their deltas. Those that do reach their deltas manage to carry sediment and industrial and agricultural toxins to the oceans, creating dead zones where nothing can live. Fisheries are collapsing world-wide. Two thousand miles of waterways in the Appalachian region no longer even exist because they have been covered over by the rubble from mountaintop mining. African elephants may go extinct within fifteen years. Glaciers are melting at alarming rates. Oil spills are endemic. An area twice the size of Nebraska turns to desert every year. Landfills are leaching toxins into groundwater. I could go on for hours with examples.

The way I see it the way that civilization teaches and requires us to see relationships is completely wrong and not an accurate representation of the truth. Civilization teaches us that the world in which we live is a world in which the inherent qualities are scarcity and competitiveness. Civilization teaches us that we must dominate or be dominated, that our very survival depends on getting for ourselves at the expense of others. But that seems counter to what I observe in reality. When I look at what is actually going on I see a world that is abundant and nurturing. That is not to say that violence and danger don’t exist in the natural world. They do. But civilization seems to exaggerate the claims of violence and danger in order to manipulate people into an incorrect and distorted worldview.

We’re taught to fear the natural world. We’re taught that the only way humans can survive is through subduing the natural world. Unless we dominate, we’re told, we will live lives of terror, constantly battling against those who would kill us. But that seems incorrect to me. Consider the animals that we’re supposed to fear. Wolves, bears, lions, snakes, alligators, and panthers, to name a few. The solution to the fear according to civilization is to kill these animals. But isn’t the fear exaggerated? Will a wolf or a bear attack a human for no reason? I’m not an expert on wolves or bears. However, I’d have to say that it seems very unlikely to me that either would attack humans unprovoked. They might attack if they felt endangered by a human. Or they might attack if extraordinarily hungry. But under average circumstances I’m guessing that a wolf or bear would just as rather have nothing to do with a human. And the fact of the matter is that prior to the advent of civilization humans lived alongside these other animals for hundreds of thousands of years without having to dominate nor be dominated.

If civilized humans and their relationships have managed to bring the entire world to the edge of total collapse in just a few thousand years then it seems to me that we really need to re-examine the way in which civilization has taught us to relate at a very fundamental level. Comparatively, uncivilized humans lived for hundreds of thousands of years while contributing to the health of the world in which they lived. Perhaps we could look to the way in which the uncivilized relate in order to learn a better way to understand ourselves and the world in which we live.

Since I am not indigenous, nor do I have much first-hand knowledge of indigenous human cultural views, I may be mistaken in my understanding of how indigenous human cultures view themselves in relationship with others. However, it is my understanding that many indigenous humans see those they are in relationship with as allies, ancestors, and friends. I have read accounts in which indigenous people of North America talk about plants and animals as their ancestors. I have read accounts of indigenous people from all many different places around the world in which they describe their understanding of the world as being a place that gives and nourishes, and a place that they have a relationship with in which they desire to give and nourish in return.

What bothers me about permaculture is that in my experiences with permaculture and permaculturists there seems to be an unchallenged fundamental way of seeing relationships that is still entirely civilized. We’ve seen what the results are of that way of relationship.


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  Banning plastic straws is harmful for people with disabilities
Posted by: Zhachev - Sat, 21 Jul 2018 16:03:28 +0000, 04:03 PM - Forum: Health & Psyche - No Replies

[Image: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DiMwj3kUcAA-5F4.jpg]


I hope John becomes aware of this, I'm interested in his comments on the story.

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  Indigenous person alone in Amazon rainforest 22 years
Posted by: Zhachev - Sat, 21 Jul 2018 15:59:32 +0000, 03:59 PM - Forum: News & Activism - Replies (1)

Believed to be last surviving member of his tribe after an attack by farmers wiped out the rest of his group


[Image: https://i.cbc.ca/1.4754640.1532086971!/f...e-hole.jpg]

All credit to our fellow poster Rick for discovering and sharing this article first.

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  New England green nihilist/anarchist
Posted by: Akephalos - Wed, 18 Jul 2018 21:24:36 +0000, 09:24 PM - Forum: Introductions - Replies (3)


Been an ecology-minded anarchist for several years (used to be a Bookchinner, lol!), got into anti-civ/post-left a few years back, also interested in practical permaculture, forest gardening, and less-destructive horticulture. 

Not really super into the survivalist/wild skills. But I do like to gather wild foods and want to expand my skills in identifying and preparing wild foods, fibers, etc. 

kinda animist/pagan but also a nihilist about it. i'm more interested in myth-making, story-telling, "finding my tribe," and loose ritual as "useless expenditure/excess" than in any greater meaning. there's a tension between embracing the empty void where there is no meaning and a mental state where i embrace the pulsing energy of everything.

i have one project: Green Anarchy New England. there's a fb just to share interesting articles and events. I'll be tabling at the Lowell anarchist bookfair on August 25th if anyone is in the region. 

If anyone is in the Boston area I would love to work on things together or even just chill with a fellow feral one. 

favorite reads: Backwoods journal, Baedan, Desert, Against His-story, Accursed Share and anything from Acephale

favorite tunes: black metal and adjacent styles. Summoning, Rotting Christ, Myrkur are some recent bands i've been listening to a lot. 

very interested in what anti-civ anarchists can do, besides reading and day-dreaming of the forest, to live ferally in places not the "backwoods," especially in a large urban city.

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  Bread is officially anti-civ-compatible
Posted by: alexander - Mon, 16 Jul 2018 21:13:40 +0000, 09:13 PM - Forum: Anthropology & History - Replies (3)

Remember on that radio show where JZ talked about how maybe we can't have bikes, but perhaps we can have beer? Well, it seems bread is safe too!

«Charred crumbs found in a pair of ancient fireplaces have been identified as the earliest examples of bread, suggesting it was being prepared long before the dawn of agriculture.» Yes, siree. «Using radiocarbon-dating of charred plant materials found within the hearths, the team found the fireplaces were used just over 14,000 years ago.»

«So bread was being made by hunter-gatherers before they started to cultivate any plants». That's interesting in and of itself, but it's also interesting how this «suggests that preparation of flatbread-like foods long predates the establishment of agriculture, and that farming in this region emerged within a pre-established culture of grinding and baking.»

You hear that, anarcho-primitivists? You got it all wrong! All these years criticising domestication and agriculture, and it turns out it was *bread* all along…


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  How Australian Aboriginies Make Thermoplastic Resin
Posted by: Odin - Sun, 15 Jul 2018 03:51:41 +0000, 03:51 AM - Forum: Skills & Decivilising - No Replies



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  The World’s Worst Industrial Disaster Is Still Unfolding
Posted by: Odin - Wed, 11 Jul 2018 00:37:59 +0000, 12:37 AM - Forum: Environment - No Replies

In the decades since, many other sites of industrial waste—in New Jersey, Missouri, Ohio—have been cleaned up. But this 70-acre site in Bhopal has, apart from the riotous jungle basil, remained mostly unchanged. Union Carbide Corporation (UCC); its former Indian subsidiary; its current owner, DowDuPont; the state government of Madhya Pradesh; and the central Indian government have all played an endless game of pass the buck. While this charade plays on, and people continue to think of Bhopal’s tragedy as one horrific night in 1984, the site still hosts hundreds of tons of contaminated waste. The Bhopal disaster is, in fact, still unfolding.


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  The Crisis of Civilisation, by Gilles Dauve
Posted by: KyXen - Tue, 10 Jul 2018 11:30:54 +0000, 11:30 AM - Forum: Anthropology & History - Replies (1)

I am starting to read this text. If anyone would like to join me in a discussion group i would welcome the chance to have a chinwag and exercise the membrane.


Quote:Capitalist civilisation differs from empire, which has a heart, a core, and when the core withers and dies, the whole system around it goes too. On the contrary, capitalism is a polycentric

The heart and core of capitalist civilisation is capital itself. The core does not wither and die, it is killed and destroyed by it's living force of labour.

My first impression is to question why Dauve feels the need to distinguish between "capitalist civilisation" and historic civilisations that he labels as "empires". In my mind capitalist civilisation is just a continuation, an amalgamation, of historic civilisations of the past.

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  Indigenous Thai Soccer Player Narrowly Avoided Fate
Posted by: Odin - Mon, 09 Jul 2018 03:52:24 +0000, 03:52 AM - Forum: News & Activism - Replies (2)

One of the Thai soccer players on the same team as the ones trapped in a cave, is a boy whose family is from the Akha Hill tribe.

When the boy was invited to join the team on the cave expedition, his mother forbade him to go, citing evil spirits. It was a decision that spared his fate of being trapped.


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  Northern hemisphere in grip of unprecedented heatwave
Posted by: joe pass - Sun, 08 Jul 2018 16:09:27 +0000, 04:09 PM - Forum: Environment - Replies (1)

"It is claimed the northern hemisphere is in the grip of an almost unprecedented heatwave.
A heat map from a University in the US shows cities have had to deal with exceptionally high heat this week.
Dramatic images from the University of Maine, show the extent to which the hot weather has impacted large areas of the globe."

"Environmental Journalist, John Gibbons, says the driver behind the soaring temperatures is climate change: "We are looking at a hemisphere-wide event which is quite unusual in weather terms and obviously here in Ireland we're benefiting from the good weather here at the moment.
"But in Canada, for example, there have been numerous fatalities from extreme temperatures and this stretches right from Russia to Europe and right across Canada so it's an almost unprecedented heat event in the northern hemisphere.
"And it is being fueled basically by rising global temperatures, the signature which is driving this process is climate change."


This summer in Ireland is particularly hot  even for this time of year. Its meant to be the hottest summer recorded in a few decades, one of the days  there was a recording of 32 degrees when a typical summers day would be between 22 to 24 degrees.Usually for summer in Ireland  the weather is mainly rainy/clammy with a few sporadic nice sunny days in between. Where I live it hasn't rained in at least 3 weeks, grass is dying in gardens, there has also been a ban put on using water hoses with a fine as penalty.

The winter was colder than usual also. It was meant to be one of the worst winters recorded in decades. Shops and roads closed for a few days because of snow. When the shops opened back up it took a few days to restock. One of the days during the snow I ventured out to try get bread, my local town was empty, no cars being able to drive, not many people walking the streets, everywhere was closed except a pub which was packed with people drinking and partying.

Are these signs of whats to come in the future?

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